Reef Discussion

[Joele]

So I was running NSW at first which I realised had a salinity of 1.030, not the end of the world and I am very slowly dropping it (a cup or two each day out so ATO tops with a little extra RO) still at around 1.029.. Temp is 26.3c

Other parameters are good(ish) Ammonia, nitrite and even nitrate are at 0 (double checked with Red Sea pro test and salifert)..

Calcium is a little low at around 400 and Alkalinity is a bit low at around 6.. Not perfect and I started my Randy recipe dosing last night (after the problems) with Kamoer dosing pump, to stop it dropping more..

Evaporation is topped up with Tunze auto unit and RO/DI which I have tested and is 0ppm..

Fish and shrimp seem fine and happy, eating well and social/active so don't seem at all stressed, but all of a sudden the elegance coral will barely open and the fugia has drastically receeded, looking like it is dying fast.. All within a day..

I am not sure what else I should test for? and could the high salinity (though always been like that) or low alkalinity (but still within the bounds of natural reefs) cause such a sudden impact? The only change is on sunday (a few days before the problem started) I did a 10% water change with Coral Sea Pro ASW (RO/DI 0ppm base) instead of NSW which I had the salinity at 1.029 as trying not to suddenly change anything with the water change..

No lighting change compared to previous weeks when corals have been fine..

 

[aussieant32]

it isnt so much about the levels they can take on a reef, it is also about how quickly the parameters swing. A large change to any of the parameters can cause them to struggle. They may just be sulking due to the change as well.

What is the alk level now? If it has changed how quick was the change?

 

[Joele]

no the alk is still 6, I am only doing the maintenance dose 0.2ml per gallon per day.. I didn't want to suddenly push it up... And only started today the problem started on tuesday..

The sulk started before I started dosing.. but maybe switching from the NSW to ASW bothered them, some other level changed? though was only 10% water change so wasn't a huge water change (didn't want to risk that)..

 

[OSCAR85]

how long have u had the coral and have you moved it lately or touched it,
Could be PH swing from low alk.
What is your PH

 

[Joele]

Had the coral 2 weeks for the fugia and maybe 3.5 for the elegance.. Haven't touched it, other than feeding mysis shrimp which they took and ate a few days before the problem (but also feed a week before as well).

I tested PH last night just before the lights went out and it was 8.3

About an hour after lights on this morning (I.e. just now) the PH is 8.0

How fast can I bring the Alk up? I thought to just let the maintenance dosing go and do 10% change maybe twice a week with the Coral Sea Pro which has a higher ALK and bring it up that way?

 

[Buddy]

I dont raise more than .5 dkh per day but you will probably get different opinions.

 

[Joele]

OK, but would 6dkh if the ph is still not swinging much (8.0 morning 8.3 evening) really a problem anyway?

I am leaning towards the change to the ASW annoyed them somehow even though it was only a 10% change and I will maybe just have to keep doing 10% water changes each week and see how it goes.. the ALK will slowly rise through that and stay up with the randy dosing..

 

[aussieant32]

you arent meant to start dosing until the levels are right. Then you monitor how much each drops per day etc and set the dosing pump to that?

 

[Joele]

Randy has suggested dose ranges from different system and says to start there and adjust based on if your ALK rises or continues to drop..

Table 1. Suggested starting daily doses of this supplement in different aquaria.
Tank Description:
Suggested Starting Doses:

Recipe #1
Recipe #2
Fish-only with live rock
0.1 mL/gallon
0.2 mL/gallon
New tank, few corals
0.2 mL/gallon
0.4 mL/gallon
Low demand
0.3 mL/gallon
0.6 mL/gallon
Mixed tank
0.5 mL/gallon
1 mL/gallon
Heavy demand (SPS corals)
1 mL/gallon
2 mL/gallon


"After a few days of dosing, note whether alkalinity is low, high or on target. Only bother to test alkalinity, not calcium, during this period, because it is much more sensitive than calcium to over- or underdosing. Adjust the dose up or down as necessary to increase or decrease the alkalinity. "

Though he does suggest getting it to where you want first as you said, I just didn't want to risk it dropping more until I can slowly get it up with water changes..

 

[Buddy]

i didn't go by that chart. i just slowly brought my parameters up to where i wanted them. then left it for a week. then i did all my tests and worked out my daily dosage.

 

[Joele]

Wouldn't it be best to use randy dosing with my dosing pump to bring it up anyway? but just do it slowly? it would be more even than trying to do it in steps via water change?

 

[aussieant32]

how have you worked out how much to dose?

 

[OSCAR85]

I can only put in down to ph swing. I use redsea coraline grow as my KH raising product. Redsea pro salt at 10% a week is not enough to keep your KH stable for 7 days. I use that salt also.
Hope this helps

 

[slin1977]

Fungi are hard to keep mate. They are sensitive IMO.
Btw KH is more important than ph
Concentrate on sorting your KH issues.
Get your magnesium to 1380
This will help you maintain KH.
Your KH should be about 9
Your ph will follow in line.
Natural seawater calcium content is 380.
RO water has low KH so I would buffer your ro water before adding it to your tank as top up.

 

[Buddy]

Fungi are hard to keep mate. They are sensitive IMO.

I lost one under a rock for over a month so it didn't have any light. When I found it I accidently dropped a rock on it and crushed half of it. One month after this it is fat and happy again and all I did was move it in to the light and flow :p Of course the water parameters are good though.

 

[slin1977]

I lost one under a rock for over a month so it didn't have any light. When I found it I accidently dropped a rock on it and crushed half of it. One month after this it is fat and happy again and all I did was move it in to the light and flow :p Of course the water parameters are good though.

I put mine in a bucket with zoas whilst I rescaped my tank once upon a time. Lets just say the zoas lived and my fungi died after that experience.

 

[Joele]

Concentrate on sorting your KH issues.
Get your magnesium to 1380
This will help you maintain KH.
Your KH should be about 9
Your ph will follow in line.
Natural seawater calcium content is 380.
RO water has low KH so I would buffer your ro water before adding it to your tank as top up.

What do you buffer the RO with? just some bicarb?

Just using randy's receipe at the moment to slowly move the KH up and see if things recover.. luckily I only have the two very small corals, fish and peppermint shrimp are happy as could be,.. If it just stays stable I will very slightly increase the dosage until I get a slow increase, someone said no more than 0.5dkh per day..

how have you worked out how much to dose?

Just started with Randy's recommendation for my size and type of tank.

 

[slin1977]

Yes you can use a bit of bi carb.
I can't remember exactly but I think I added about a teaspoon to 15 litres of RO water.
(test RO before and after adding bi carb)
You will have to play around a bit with that.

Here's what I would do ...
Get KH , Mag ,Ca in line with a value you believe you want to set. Test and record daily for a week. This will give you an idea of consumption. Set dosing to suit.
Test again daily for a week.

Use the best quality sea salt, might take you years to find one that suits your style of reefkeeping, this is my opinion again.
Be realistic about your tanks requirements,
If its LPS you got you don't need to crank them with high KH.

 

[slin1977]

I used to add bi carb to my RO water, I have since set my reactor up to compensate for the low KH of RO.
Once you are familiar with your dosing set up you will be able to set your dosing pumps to take the low KH of your top up water into account without the need to add bi carb to it.

 

[Joele]

OK well got the dosing right, I am keeping it from dropping at all (KH and Calcium).. So from here I am slowly going to bring it up, still only around 6.5dkh but ph seems stable.. Will get it up over next few weeks, don't want to push it.. Once where I want it I will start working on Magnesium..

Elegance coral is opening up again fine since yesterday morning and seems no worse for wear at all, the orange fugia still glows, but won't open up again, yet...

I think I know what contributed to the problem, I put a phosphate reactor on with rowaphos (correctly cleaned so no iron mist). I originally expected my rather high phosphates was from the live rock, I think now it wasn't it was the NSW from the LFS (which at the start I didn't even thing of testing).. The reason I say that is the turnaround was so sudden, from huge levels to not being able to detect it at all anymore. I have read it is possible that sudden swing could have shocked the corals a bit? along with my dropping dkh which as I said got to 6, though my NSW is only around 8..

Sucks really as the NSW I had been getting had a salinity of 1.030 but lowish dkh, which means I would have to water it down with RO but then deal with the KH before adding, I guess that is a point in favor of using ASW?

Anyway on the improve, 0 phosphate (need a low range test kit), KH stable and slowly on the way up, PH is still holding between from 8.1 to 8.3 (morning to evening), salinity stable at 1.026, temp at 26c.. Ammonia, nitrites and even nitrates still all at 0. (purigen works well in saltwater too it seems)..