Reef Discussion

[Maddclimb]

Hi all,

So I've recently got the Aqua One Mini Reef 160 and it is giving me a hell of a headache!
I thought it would be a simple plug and play kinda system but its giving me hell.

So the issue is with the drain pipe into the sump.
It's a Durso standpipe and I'm not having the issues with the 'toilet flush' where the water level in the overflow falls and rises producing a gurgling noise.
The drain into the sump is producing so much bubbles its like a spa and noisy as hell! The bubbles bursting at the surface is getting the cabinet wet and dripping making my carpet wet!

I wanted to install a ball valve to maybe slow down the flow but these pipes are not normal sized pipes (around 30 and 10mm?)
I got a jebao 3000 pump and dialled it down to the lowest setting (1800) and it doesn't make a difference. Should I have gotten an even lower return pump?
I put a T fitting on the end of the drain pipe and it made no difference. (Just taped a 25mm fitting on)
I have noticed people recommending the drain only be a couple inches below the water line. Mine is nearly at the bottom of the sump. I am considering cutting it back but worried that itll make it worse and then I won't be able to reextend it because of Aqua Ones wierd pipe sizes.

PLEASE HELP!

 

[megsez]

Hi maddclimb,

I have a slightly different set up but was having the same issue at one stage. After a bit of reaserching i found a lot of people made the whole larger in the top cap of the durso stand pipe (last picture)

Slowly work your way up in re sizeing it with a drill untill it stops.

However what i have done now is drill a hole big enough to accomidate your standard aquarium airl line hose and then insert a lenghth of air hose that gos about halfway down the pipe. You may need to play with the length but this inserts the air further down. You can also put an adjuster on the end of the air line to act at re sizeing the hole you would normally drill.

May be worth a shot. You may also have bettrr luck at specialist irrigation shops for that pipe size.

 

[Maddclimb]

Thanks megsez, Ill give that a go when i get my hands on a drill...
In the meantime ive added the filter sock and that seems to have limited the bubbles and noise however theres still a bit of splash getting stuff wet. I don't really want to have to use a filter sock though...

 

[megsez]

Good to hear that the sock has helped some. I try and avoif them as well and only use them when i do a water change to filter the water after. Re size the hole and add the venturi.

Dose the set up have a ball valve o the pipe to control flow?

 

[Maddclimb]

Since the sock has been in, the durso has started to make a siphony/gurgly noise. I think that is an indication that the hole on top is too small. Its gotten worse over the last day or so probably due to the sock getting dirty and allowing less air to escape?

There are no ball valves on the system. I was keen to add them but as i mentioned before, the pipe sizes aren't Aus standard and I have literally no plumbing experience.

 

[megsez]

Yes the sock will more then likely be the cause. It raises the water level on the outlet of the pipe and it will creat a full siphon untill the water levels drops enough on the intake and sucks air in and the cycle continues.

Your correct in that it needs the bigger hole in the top. Its trial and error with the size though. You need to make small increases in size and keep trying to see if it has worked. If not then make it bigger untill you find the spot that works.

Adding a ball valve will make the fine tuning of the system a lot easier as you can control the flow rate.

Looking at bunnings they do 15mm ball valve threaded or solvent weld and you should be able to get reduces to take that down to 10mm. If you get a ball valve just make sure it is plastic and has no copper parts.

The white plastic ones with the red handles are the cheapest but are a pain to fine tune. The black plastic ones have nylon covered stainless valves and are much easier. I am going to change my ones to this style next opertunity i get.

If you are on the sunshine coast id be more then happy to give you a hand but i dont think you are.

Do you have any irigation specilast were you are as they are normally better stocked then bunnings?

 

[Maddclimb]

Over the past week I noticed that the noise and bubbles have pretty much stopped. It was only until the weekend that I realised there was a kink in my return hose causing the return flow to decrease,

I made the durso hole big enough to fit some airline tubing down the standpipe with an airvalve on top. It did help a little but was still producing a lot of bubbles. I think the solution is going to have to reduce the flow of the return either by getting a weaker return pump or adding a ball valve to the return line?

I'm going to have to track down some piping that will fit. I'll have a search of irrigation specialists and see how I go.

Unfortunately not, I'm in Melbourne. :(

 

[megsez]

Thats good it is better then what it was. To reduce the flow from the return pump you may just be able to put a valve on the return line. Or plumb in a return to the sump for a future reactor etc so you can upgrade to bigger pumps if you need to down the track and still be able to control the flow. Not nowing how your set up is plumbed may or may not be possible.

Have you started a journel yet?

 

[Maddclimb]

Havent started a journal yet but will do once my tanks done cycling... 2 weeks in and still no nitrite! (Using dry rock and dr tims).

 

[Maddclimb]

What type of primer and solvent should i be using thats reef safe?

 

[megsez]

Look forward to seeing the journal start. Is the primer or solvent for the pipes?

 

[Maddclimb]

Yea, its for the pipes. Theres different colours for different applications? and pressure and non pressure? Wasn't sure which type I should be using...

 

[megsez]

Yea, its for the pipes. Theres different colours for different applications? and pressure and non pressure? Wasn't sure which type I should be using...

I have alway used the blue plumbing type. Just go to plumbing supplies or bunnings and just make sure it is food grade.

 

[Maddclimb]

I finally installed my new plumbing and it is quiet as now!
I converted the single durso style drain to the herbie style and plumbed the return to the back of the tank and back up. I have probably used too many 90 degree bends for the return but I'm not too fussed!

This is more for those with the mini reef but I replaced all the stock piping that came with the tank.
The two pre-drilled holes in the tank I am using as both drainage with a 15mm as the main siphon and a 25mm as the emergency.
The bulkheads I used 15 and 25mm tank outlets from bunnings but the bulkhead part was too big and I just trimmed it back a bit to make it fit. Looks ugly but it doesn't leak!
Popped a union on the 25mm drain into the sump and a union ball valve on the 15mm drain to control the water level in the overflow.
The return piping is also 15mm, connected with vinyl tubing to the pump and goes up behind the tank back into the overflow box.
Now I just need a outlet duct that will fit into a 15mm 90 degree fitting and the job should be done!

The whole job was such a headache, getting all the parts and realising something doesn't fit or stressing about the imminent leaks.
Looks ugly but I am pretty stoked with the amateur work I've done! haha!

 

[megsez]

Looking good and glad its worked well. Is very rewarding plumbing i have found. Have you started your journal up yet?

 

[Maddclimb]

Not yet, tank is still cycling!
I might start one anyway to keep me busy :)

 

[megsez]

Not yet, tank is still cycling!
I might start one anyway to keep me busy :)

Yes can be frustrating the waiting but best advice and reefer will give is dont rush it lol. Remember lots of pics :)

 

[Clarkernucci]

Hi Maddclimb,

I hope that you are still around on this site.

Having brought the Aqua One Mini Reef 150 on 13th Feb 2019. I have just spent the last week going through all that you have described in your thread.

Before reading your comments, my gut feeling was to try to put a ball valve/gate valve onto the main drain pipe. Then to convert the current return pipe into an emergency overflow. Then run the pump return out of the rear of the cabinet, up the tank and over the top.

I had assumed that the current return pipe being only 15 mm wouldn't be able to handle that volume of water as the main drain for the weir.

Having been running this fix for 6 months now, could you please answer me a few questions?

1. Once I switch to the "Herbie Method", will the 15mm drain definitely handle the flow of water?

2. Why did you opt to make the main drain the emergency overflow and not the other way round?

3. I noticed from your photo ending 858.jpg that you placed the main drain quite low in the weir, any reason for this?

4. From your description, I think that you ran the return over the outside of the tank and into the weir then back out of the original hole through the weir and into the main tank? was this just for neatness, any reason you didn't just do a 90 into the main tank?

5. Why have you put a valve on the pump outlet, is this to restrict the flow of to prevent back flow when doing maintenance?

6. Most importantly.... Did this fix the noise, is it worth doing?

7. Would you do anything differently if you did this again work (apart from not buying an Aqua One :)

Thanks in advance

 

[Maddclimb]

Hi Clarkernucci,

I'll try and answer your questions, if I can remember, with my logic behind what I did. For some reason, I think my situation was a lot worse than a lot of others that I've seen online. Some people managed to fix it with a simple fix but nothing worked for me and my method was pretty drastic.
I also wanted to put a ball valve onto the main drain but I couldn't find one that fitted. People also mentioned the ball valve clogging over time and I was worried about flooding. The thing I would worry about with your gut feeling set up is if the ball valve got clogged you might get flooded because the emergency drain is smaller than the main.

Now onto your questions:
1. I guess it depends on how powerful your return pump is? and how much water it pushes up. I'm currently using the jebao 3000 on the middle setting and if the ball valve is completely open, it can handle it no problem.

2. As mentioned above, if you use the 25mm as the main, and that fails, there is no way the 15mm is going to be able to drain the water fast enough. You want the emergency to be bigger in case your main fails. Did that make sense?

3. The main drain is supposed to be lower than the emergency. I forgot the reasoning behind this but its something to do with starting the siphon assisted by gravity?
http://gmacreef.com/herbie-overflow-reef-tank-plumbing-method-basics/
The link above helped a lot in helping me understand.

4. Yes, it was basically just for neatness. I also wanted to block of the hole so that fish etc wouldn't be able to swim in and potentially get sucked down into the sump. I never found an outlet duct by the way, just got lazy and never got around to it.

5. Yes, however I have never used it and just let it flow back into the sump when I turn the return off haha. The level in the sump does rise quite high so be careful if you forget to turn it off. Also good to make sure that your sump won't overflow if your return pump fails.

6.It has 100% fixed the noise. It is now probably the most quiet part of the system.

7. I don't think I'd do anything differently. It is working pretty perfect after 6 months and I haven't done anything to it. I would probably spend more time making measurements because its a bit wonky right now. Also maybe mount the pipes against the cabinet so it has more support. I'd also like to make some manifolds so I can connect some reactors. But for its purpose, it is running fantastic!

Hope this has helped you out.

 

[Clarkernucci]

Hi Maddclimb,

Thanks for your reply (sorry I didn't have notifications on)

What you have suggested makes a lot of sense to me.

I was just re-looking at your post and all the plumbing under my tank.

I have been considering attempting to use the existing plumbing (or some of it) i.e keep the original Aqua One overflow but convert it to the emergency drain and then cut down the original return pipe thats in the weir, to convert it to the main drain and extend it into the sump

Was there any reason that you chose to discard the original plumbing and went with new?

p.s. Do you have a video of how it sounds now?

Thanks again